Project of the Month, May 2k11 Options

[Knot]

I actually couldn't disagree more xD

This would be all well and dandy if the POTM was about quality but it's actually a popularity contest (hey, I'm all for that and it's what I love about it!). If we had reviewers going around and judging the games based on their quality then we would deffinitly need demos but as it stands I think it is more of an issue, like Rob said, as to whether it would really make a difference or not to allow Games Under Construction in. It just seems to be the same people nominating the games and there arn't many of us!

This post has been edited by Knot: May 26 2011, 03:40 PM

[Sailerius]

It's a lot easier to throw together a cool pitch for a game and say it's under construction than to actually complete a game. If there are unplayable projects thrown up for vote, then it only further encourages people to not play the games that are nominated - instead, they'll just vote based on how they look.

Plus, it gives incentive to actually finish your game.

[Axerax]

Then why complain about a system if you know it is flawed. There are plenty of projects under construction that have plenty of content that should involve the community while it is being created.

That's one thing I've always hated about RRR, one works hard for all and gets no help back. Maybe I'd actually get a demo completed if I had more help than my self seeking out assistance on a seperate website.

Everyone is so prejeduce about long demos and completed projects that it is discouraging to others who don't have enough content or don't want to prematurely release a demo for their game out of pressure to release one. How about working with those who need the praise and help and not so much those better off, we know who has completed games and who has long demos, but I'm going to outright say that about 75% of these demos and completed games are watered down quick releases with little to no effort put forth into the project. It's no wonder you have no projects to put up.

And to Rob:
For your snide remark, I was ready to release a Kailis demo less than a month before my harddrive crashed losing a good portion of the game. I'm sorry i'm so inferior to not release a demo on a project that my team has put hours upon hours of work into just to get it out there. I want my game to look good, which is why I waited, to get bugs out and make sure things are as smooth as I can get them before release. Grief.

This post has been edited by Axerax: May 27 2011, 12:19 AM

[Sailerius]

but I'm going to outright say that about 75% of these demos and completed games are watered down quick releases with little ot no effort put forth into the project.

Care to back up your claim with some citations? There are about 500 such projects, so can you name which 375 are "watered down quick releases with little to no effort put forth?"

[Rob_Riv]

And to Rob:
For your snide remark, I was ready to release a Kailis demo less than a month before my harddrive crashed losing a good portion of the game. I'm sorry i'm so inferior to not release a demo on a project that my team has put hours upon hours of work into just to get it out there. I want my game to look good, which is why I waited, to get bugs out and make sure things are as smooth as I can get them before release. Grief.

It wasn't a snide remark. Project of the Month is for Long Demos and Complete Games. If you haven't got either, you have no chance of being nominated. That was all my point was.

The point still stands that even with Games Under Construction being allowed, there probably won't be enough quality games for Project of the Month.

[Axerax]

but I'm going to outright say that about 75% of these demos and completed games are watered down quick releases with little ot no effort put forth into the project.

Care to back up your claim with some citations? There are about 500 such projects, so can you name which 375 are "watered down quick releases with little to no effort put forth?"

Yes I'm sure I could. If I did not have a job that prevents me from playing all of these projects I'd give you a list of projects i don't think are up to par.

The point I'm trying to make is that you guys never give credit to those actually working hard, they are the ones that need it the most right now. If you are running out of completed/demo projects, you need to expand your horizon and think outside the box. I know quite a few developers who have gotten extremely lucky with their projects to get them completed. At the same time, I know quite a few others who are still working on the same projects and have been for some years now along with my team's project. I think higher of them than all the people who got lucky. It's great that they're suceeding but I also see potential in those that they shadow.

[Rob_Riv]

The point I'm trying to make is that you guys never give credit to those actually working hard, they are the ones that need it the most right now. If you are running out of completed/demo projects, you need to expand your horizon and think outside the box.

"You guys" refers to the Project of the Month, right?

There's no reason a featured Game Under Construction couldn't exist, except for that there needs to be a good number of quality projects to choose from, which I maintain, there are not.

[Brent Murray]

Another reason to make the POTM more of a seasonal thing, or a 3 month waiting list before doing one.

Because, yeah, there aren't a lot of projects to choose from in a one month span unless you want some broken down demos and games that aren't really completed... Another thing that we could do is drop the POTM and just focus on some upcoming games that are showing a lot of promise and poise, then other members can post about anything particular they have played in the past few weeks that might garner a look or two.

EDIT: 500th Post! Woot!

This post has been edited by Brent Murray: May 27 2011, 12:48 AM

[Axerax]

The point I'm trying to make is that you guys never give credit to those actually working hard, they are the ones that need it the most right now. If you are running out of completed/demo projects, you need to expand your horizon and think outside the box.

"You guys" refers to the Project of the Month, right?

There's no reason a featured Game Under Construction couldn't exist, except for that there needs to be a good number of quality projects to choose from, which I maintain, there are not.

Yes it does.

Then there is no reason to call it Project of the Month. Why not just call it Completed Game of the Month or Long Demo of the Month? At least then I'd give you more credit for what you claim this event is really for.

Tch - I liked it better when I ran PotM. At least when I ran it, the staff picked the nominations and there were 3 categories : Completed Game, Project, and Sandbox Project of the Month. All 3 won and you didn't run out of nominations so quickly. As well there was a 3 month wall for all nominated projects to wait before being renominated and projects that won, had a 1 year wait so that we could conduct a legitimate Project of the Year competition.

I tried to give you guys some advice, you can take it or leave it. But it seems like you're all stuck up on your selves and to brave to say that you're wrong.

[Brent Murray]

Hey, that doesn't sound half bad, Axerax.

(How come you stopped running it, then? Either way, I like that idea, too.)

[Rob_Riv]

Tch - I liked it better when I ran PotM. At least when I ran it, the staff picked the nominations and there were 3 categories : Completed Game, Project, and Sandbox Project of the Month. All 3 won and you didn't run out of nominations so quickly. As well there was a 3 month wall for all nominated projects to wait before being renominated and projects that won, had a 1 year wait so that we could conduct a legitimate Project of the Year competition.

What happened to it? I can only see one thread, for September 2008. If there was only one, I don't see how you can claim that you didn't run out of nominations.

I tried to give you guys some advice, you can take it or leave it. But it seems like you're all stuck up on your selves and to brave to say that you're wrong.

Because we disagree with you, we're "stuck up on ourselves and too brave to say we're wrong"?

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 27 2011, 01:49 AM

[Axerax]

Hey, that doesn't sound half bad, Axerax.

(How come you stopped running it, then? Either way, I like that idea, too.)

Glad to see someone agrees with me.

I can answer that and it will answer the quote below here. If you were around when I was still moderating this and chat you would know that I had joined the Navy. I went to bootcamp shortly after putting up the nominations. I passed along the torch to From_Ariel and a few others who wanted to keep it going. Everyone liked my idea and I figured it would continue until I could come back and take back the reigns.

Unfortunately for me even after changing the forum, to what I think was more organized, the new crew decided to tear down everything I built up.Please note that I spent a month and a half before going to bootcamp pruning the projects forum, something that apparently no one noticed or cared to acknowledge me doing, just to allow for a more fair PotM thread. As well the forum organization changed once again and so all of my work, before hand when I had time to work with RRR full time, disappeared.

When I came back it was being ran by someone else, and this is within 3 months time, I was fairly upset and couldn't believe the damage. I stopped caring and let it fall apart. Harry picked it up later on after my first deployment maybe shortly before the end of it, but now here it is at the standstill. The forum still continues to change and there is nothing I'm going to do to change it for bad or for good.

Tch - I liked it better when I ran PotM. At least when I ran it, the staff picked the nominations and there were 3 categories : Completed Game, Project, and Sandbox Project of the Month. All 3 won and you didn't run out of nominations so quickly. As well there was a 3 month wall for all nominated projects to wait before being renominated and projects that won, had a 1 year wait so that we could conduct a legitimate Project of the Year competition.

What happened to it? I can only see one thread, for September 2008. If there was only one, I don't see how you can claim that you didn't run out of nominations.

If From_Ariel and the participants who were supposed to continue the PotM thread had done as they said they were, it would have worked out. How can you run out of nominations when you only put up 5 from each forum every month, you couldn't even get through ALL of the completed games doing this. In theory it would have worked, but here we are putting up 6-11 or more nominations, thus running out.

I tried to give you guys some advice, you can take it or leave it. But it seems like you're all stuck up on your selves and to brave to say that you're wrong.

Because we disagree with you, we're "stuck up on ourselves and too brave to say we're wrong"?

No because you are refusing to see the truth behind what I am saying. You know I am right and won't say so. Maybe this is because you want to win your own arguement, I may not be right in assessing this, but it's what I gather from all the hostility to someone who is giving a solid suggestion to help the situation. But seriously, who puts up an argument to try and win it, why even open your mouth? If you are really so dead set on fixing this mess then maybe you should take the help you get... Jeez.

I wish I wouldn't have even offered to help such a lost cause.

[Rob_Riv]

How can you run out of nominations when you only put up 5 from each forum every month, you couldn't even get through ALL of the completed games doing this.

I believe the projects being referred to are recent projects.

No because you are refusing to see the truth behind what I am saying. You know I am right and won't say so. Maybe this is because you want to win your own arguement, I may not be right in assessing this, but it's what I gather from all the hostility to someone who is giving a solid suggestion to help the situation. But seriously, who puts up an argument to try and win it, why even open your mouth? If you are really so dead set on fixing this mess then maybe you should take the help you get... Jeez.

I wish I wouldn't have even offered to help such a lost cause.

I don't think you're right about including Games Under Construction. My main point has been that there aren't enough quality projects, even with Games Under Construction. You raised the point that in your Project of the Month "you didn't run out of nominations so quickly", but there's no evidence of that. I checked your Project of the Month thread, and there are 23 nominations! You said in your post earlier...

As well there was a 3 month wall for all nominated projects to wait before being renominated

You would run out of nominations. So it's not me "refusing to see the truth", or me "knowing you are right" or me being "stuck up on myself". I just think you're wrong.

Also, there is the argument given by Sailerius.

It's a lot easier to throw together a cool pitch for a game and say it's under construction than to actually complete a game. If there are unplayable projects thrown up for vote, then it only further encourages people to not play the games that are nominated - instead, they'll just vote based on how they look.

Plus, it gives incentive to actually finish your game.

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 27 2011, 08:01 AM

[kaz]

Hey, that doesn't sound half bad, Axerax.

(How come you stopped running it, then? Either way, I like that idea, too.)

Glad to see someone agrees with me.

I can answer that and it will answer the quote below here. If you were around when I was still moderating this and chat you would know that I had joined the Navy. I went to bootcamp shortly after putting up the nominations. I passed along the torch to From_Ariel and a few others who wanted to keep it going. Everyone liked my idea and I figured it would continue until I could come back and take back the reigns.

Unfortunately for me even after changing the forum, to what I think was more organized, the new crew decided to tear down everything I built up.Please note that I spent a month and a half before going to bootcamp pruning the projects forum, something that apparently no one noticed or cared to acknowledge me doing, just to allow for a more fair PotM thread. As well the forum organization changed once again and so all of my work, before hand when I had time to work with RRR full time, disappeared.

When I came back it was being ran by someone else, and this is within 3 months time, I was fairly upset and couldn't believe the damage. I stopped caring and let it fall apart. Harry picked it up later on after my first deployment maybe shortly before the end of it, but now here it is at the standstill. The forum still continues to change and there is nothing I'm going to do to change it for bad or for good.

Tch - I liked it better when I ran PotM. At least when I ran it, the staff picked the nominations and there were 3 categories : Completed Game, Project, and Sandbox Project of the Month. All 3 won and you didn't run out of nominations so quickly. As well there was a 3 month wall for all nominated projects to wait before being renominated and projects that won, had a 1 year wait so that we could conduct a legitimate Project of the Year competition.

What happened to it? I can only see one thread, for September 2008. If there was only one, I don't see how you can claim that you didn't run out of nominations.

If From_Ariel and the participants who were supposed to continue the PotM thread had done as they said they were, it would have worked out. How can you run out of nominations when you only put up 5 from each forum every month, you couldn't even get through ALL of the completed games doing this. In theory it would have worked, but here we are putting up 6-11 or more nominations, thus running out.

I tried to give you guys some advice, you can take it or leave it. But it seems like you're all stuck up on your selves and to brave to say that you're wrong.

Because we disagree with you, we're "stuck up on ourselves and too brave to say we're wrong"?

No because you are refusing to see the truth behind what I am saying. You know I am right and won't say so. Maybe this is because you want to win your own arguement, I may not be right in assessing this, but it's what I gather from all the hostility to someone who is giving a solid suggestion to help the situation. But seriously, who puts up an argument to try and win it, why even open your mouth? If you are really so dead set on fixing this mess then maybe you should take the help you get... Jeez.

I wish I wouldn't have even offered to help such a lost cause.

Axerax- the forum was run by the same "crew" as when you left, you were thanked at the time when you first made the changes and equally you know that it was returned to the old layout because of member complaints.


http://www.rpgrevolution.com/forums/index....c=20758&hl= This is in the archives- relating to your POTM?

[Harryb412]

What Games Under Construction are worthy of PotM and how many worthy games are made a month?

[Oceans Dream]

"Guys, please revamp the system so my gam gets in"
-Axerax

[Axerax]

You are so childish. Someone tries to help you and then you do this. I'm done here. I don't care if my projects make it or not.

I was suggesting to open it to that, because that's how it originally was.

How can anyone even assume I would be so selfish to want to boost myself like that, how underhanded is that? Especially as how often I have attempted to appease and help the community as a whole with what little talents I have to provide to the public.

I was at least open with everyone and accepting of suggestions when I ran it.

You were NOT in charge at that time, when I left. Sadly the only thing that did not come of that post was me going to California, not that it matters, my orders changed.

What games are worthy of PotM in games under construction? How about actually looking at the projects yourself, rather than rely on the community, they are counting on you as much as you count on them to make the right choices. There is a famous quote that explains this situation thoroughly... You can't always get your cake and eat it too. or even better If you want something done right, do it yourself.

I'm not going to sit here and be punked around by you all. Seriously the only one sensibly accepting anything here is HarryB, even he himself is sceptical, but I explained how it utlimately falls on him to look at them and figure it out himself. My only suggestion was to open it to Games Under Construction, with no intentions of getting my game in there even if I used mine as an example, but that was not accepted only beaten and battered without question as to why do you think this will work.

This post has been edited by Axerax: May 27 2011, 10:59 AM

[Rob_Riv]

You're not being punked. Arguments against what you have suggested have been provided. Also, you have made unsubstantiated claims like "you didn't run out of nominations so quickly" with your version of Project of the Month.

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 27 2011, 11:00 AM

[Nessiah]

How can anyone even assume I would be so selfish to want to boost myself like that, how underhanded is that? Especially as how often I have attempted to appease and help the community as a whole with what little talents I have to provide to the public.

You should keep doing this because you need 12 nominations for a PotY competition. Maybe the staff actually reviewed the projects in development rather than long demos and stuff. Cause I know I've been in the community for a long time and put lots of work into my games with my team, but not once has any of them came up for PotM. Not once.

Maybe if I actually got a nomination for my teams hard work I'd care more, but it's been too many now that i've never seen a single EMD game in production. It's really to the point I just stop looking at nominations to vote because I figure I'm still not there. Even with how much I try to help the community with graphic arts and commissions.

It's probably that.

This post has been edited by Nessiah: May 27 2011, 07:10 PM

[Axerax]

You're not being punked. Arguments against what you have suggested have been provided. Also, you have made unsubstantiated claims like "you didn't run out of nominations so quickly" with your version of Project of the Month.

I wouldn't have, had I not had to leave and drop the ball to someone else. Can you explain to me about 5 nominations from each category would run out? When some people are saying there are 500 completed games? Then there shouldn't be a problem there because that's 60 games. 60 from each category.

My problem is that RRR wants to call it Project of the Month, but refuses to use exactly what I'm suggesting to add... Projects... I made the point pretty clear that you, as in you the staff members, should be picking the nominee's. This would include being able to decifer a quickly put together topic from a project that has obviously had time put into it. Rather than only picking from Completed Games and Long Demos. This contest is more of a pissing contest than a contest of effort and value.

How can anyone even assume I would be so selfish to want to boost myself like that, how underhanded is that? Especially as how often I have attempted to appease and help the community as a whole with what little talents I have to provide to the public.

You should keep doing this because you need 12 nominations for a PotY competition. Maybe the staff actually reviewed the projects in development rather than long demos and stuff. Cause I know I've been in the community for a long time and put lots of work into my games with my team, but not once has any of them came up for PotM. Not once.

Maybe if I actually got a nomination for my teams hard work I'd care more, but it's been too many now that i've never seen a single EMD game in production. It's really to the point I just stop looking at nominations to vote because I figure I'm still not there. Even with how much I try to help the community with graphic arts and commissions.

It's probably that.

...My only suggestion was to open it to Games Under Construction, with no intentions of getting my game in there even if I used mine as an example...

This post has been edited by Axerax: May 27 2011, 08:09 PM