Puzzle Games, Do you enjoy them? Options

[Genten]

There is already a topic about puzzles that I've read over here but it was mostly about puzzle elements in RPGs. I'd like to see how many people are interested in games that are more puzzle-based instead of a standard RPG with puzzle elements.

Some of my favorite RPGMaker games are Ib and Ao Oni. Both are horror games wherein players progress by solving puzzles. Any battle system is simply enemy avoidance; the characters have no way of fighting back and must avoid any foes. The game makes the player solve puzzles to progress. These games still have a plot, but it's not based on defeating bosses or such. I'm curious if anyone is interested in these sorts of games because I've never seen anything similar posted in the project forum. Is it because the difficulty of programming such a thing is too high, or is there simply no interest?

My basic question is, what do you think of games (perhaps RPG games if you've played them) that are puzzle focused and do not include standard monster fights compared to games that add puzzles as a small element,as in a straight RPG game? Straight RPG game being one where the main element is fighting monsters, clearing dungeons, defeating boses, etc.

[Shaddow]

I am a firm believer that there is room for any type of game, it is not about how many people like that type of game, but more about how many people you can MAKE like that type of game. Sure it may be harder to implement, and some people may not like it at first. Yet, if you work really hard and make it interesting enough to make up for the love of leveling and numbers that a lot of people have.

Personally a unique type of game is very interesting to me, one of the most anticipated games for me on RRR is Profit Motive, which has 'battles' but in such a unique way that they might as well not be called such, they do not have levels, but they have strategy. This is a great way to bring interest. So, yes, I suppose I am saying that there is room for this type of game, but in the end it is all about how you present it and how much fun it is.

[Clord]

It is rather easy to use RPG Maker and make games like that. Also how those games looks like is not that great but at least they try to have their own style.

However while those games might be interesting to play, for me they are rather boring to make. I just like to do RPG games.

This post has been edited by Clord: Oct 10 2012, 02:36 PM

[vvalkingman]

Well, I am designing a game that is about a thief that uses their intelligence and speed to steal things from vaults which is pretty puzzle heavy. I recall an old school snes game called Lufia 2 Rise of the Sinistrals which is a puzzle heavy rpg which makes use of standard menu based battle system but a puzzle system that works with tools found throughout dungeons and the world. When I think about this kind of idea I'm also reminded of Phi Brain, an anime about geniuses that solve deadly puzzles. The concept, if done correctly, could be quite interesting. It is a niche market depending on the difficulty of the puzzles and the kind of puzzles. To answer your question, it might be a nice change of pace. But I can't stress how a good story/hook is key. My opinion anyway.

[Kaust]

Well being a site with rpg in the title, and being a site devoted to the use of the RPGMaker engines, I think you're gna find one or two rpg fans here . Still, puzzles are practically integral to the rpg style (Legend of Zelda for instance), and beyond that nobody likes just one style of game so dont be surprised by the support you find.

I wouldn't say puzzle games are more complex to program; simply a different idea with different focuses. While both would have an overriding narrative a puzzle game would likely be less interested in the intricacies of character development or character relationships- any characters really just being your stand-in to perform the puzzle (like Luke in Professor Layton). In turn, however, they have to provide us with completely new styles of puzzles or seriously reworked older puzzles for entertainment which is a tricky task, Rm or no.

What I will say from my experience dabbling with RM is that its good for making rpgs, and as aforementioned, the style of puzzles you see in the genre, but not so good in other aspects. For example I've only seen one passable shooter, a couple of passable platformers, so if you are planning something that seems like its not going to 'work', well, with enough effort it will, but there are other easier methods outside of RM.

[Lato]

Eh I actually don't like to see a lot of puzzles in my RPG games for the simple fact that when I think of the good puzzle games I have played they are all non RPG like Resident Evil and Dino Crisis. Now im not saying its a bad thing to have them in the game but for me it just kinda rubs me the wrong way.

[Clord]

Eh I actually don't like to see a lot of puzzles in my RPG games for the simple fact that when I think of the good puzzle games I have played they are all non RPG like Resident Evil and Dino Crisis. Now im not saying its a bad thing to have them in the game but for me it just kinda rubs me the wrong way.

Are you sure you are not reading my mind? Our preferences are so similar.

Doing puzzles to RPG games about story and combat tends me to make prefer that the puzzles are optional and not necessary to complete the game. However in case of FFVII, getting that safe open is greatly rewarded and makes the optional puzzle meaningful (if you can call it as one.)

This post has been edited by Clord: Oct 16 2012, 03:36 AM

[Ndoelicious]

Eh I actually don't like to see a lot of puzzles in my RPG games for the simple fact that when I think of the good puzzle games I have played they are all non RPG like Resident Evil and Dino Crisis. Now im not saying its a bad thing to have them in the game but for me it just kinda rubs me the wrong way.

Yes, if you meant the Dino Crisis 1. THe Dino Crisis 2 has less puzzle but more actions, not that it's not 'puzzilingly-fun' but it still good.
Resident Evil! Now we're talking about why this game rocks! Well, we can't do anything like RE in RPG, since that means limiting our supply of save, bullets and options, which in common sense of RPG, the more options we have, the better the gameplay will be.
As for RPG-ish puzzle such as this, as long as it still has a good amount of seriousness and not to overwhelming the player, I guess it's fine.
We're gamers, not Sherlock..

[Dark Kyu]

I know one game where it's mainly a puzzle game but it's still fun, Catherine by Atlus. You can find the game here

It's quite an interesting game too and it's a good example of doing an entirely puzzle-based game.

This post has been edited by Dark Kyu: Jan 29 2013, 04:13 AM

[Dark Gaia]

Generally, I think puzzles are optional in an RPG but they make a nice optional distraction and add more to the gameplay aside from combat. In a J-RPG, combat is really the main element of the gameplay. Exploration usually boils down to just walking through an area to gather enough EXP and items for the next battle. Putting a puzzle in a dungeon to solve makes exploration more fun, and adds more challenges to the game that aren't centered around combat.

In Legionwood (and to a much greater extent, Legionwood 2) I tried to throw a gimmick or problem to solve in each dungeon the player moved through, to make it more interesting than if it had simply been a maze. Likewise, in my One Night games, there are heaps of puzzles, because puzzle solving is an integral part of the classical survival horror formula. Putting puzzles into your game can't hurt at all. Most people enjoy them. A tip, however, is to always have the answers readily available to your players, because some people will get stuck.

[userjosh704]

I played a lot of RE games, so I'm happy with puzzles. Can't specifically recall, but other games with ancient ruins and puzzles were par for the course. Tales of Phantasia and Breath of Fire 3 had them a lot if I recall correctly. Simple puzzles are block pushing and putting shiny rocks in the right slots and it's fun. Throw in a key or two for me to fetch, give me clues in the form of riddles about how to activate the secret magic door. Keep it simple and short but use it frequently. Don't let it interfere with exploration too much. You could make the puzzle a reason for exploration, that facilitates a good dungeon crawl.

This post has been edited by userjosh704: Apr 23 2013, 06:12 AM