Project of the Month, May 2k11 Options

[Harryb412]

If enough people are on board to give it ago I will try to reboot this next month to include Games Under Construction,
the reason we ran out of projects is because nobody was nominating any more, implying that nobody thought any other projects were worthy of Project of the Month.

I'm still geared towards Project of the Year and just having the best projects of this year nominated to vote for.

Perhaps a competition called something like Monthly Project Awards and rather than whole projects winning, certain projects are nominated for different categories?
Like Best Character, Best Mapping, etc etc.

[Rob_Riv]

You're not being punked. Arguments against what you have suggested have been provided. Also, you have made unsubstantiated claims like "you didn't run out of nominations so quickly" with your version of Project of the Month.

I wouldn't have, had I not had to leave and drop the ball to someone else. Can you explain to me about 5 nominations from each category would run out? When some people are saying there are 500 completed games? Then there shouldn't be a problem there because that's 60 games. 60 from each category.

My problem is that RRR wants to call it Project of the Month, but refuses to use exactly what I'm suggesting to add... Projects... I made the point pretty clear that you, as in you the staff members, should be picking the nominee's. This would include being able to decifer a quickly put together topic from a project that has obviously had time put into it. Rather than only picking from Completed Games and Long Demos. This contest is more of a pissing contest than a contest of effort and value.

Because, as I said, when we say projects, we are talking about recent projects.

I understand the name thing, but I just don't think there are enough projects of quality to make it worthwhile to open it up to Games Under Construction.

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 28 2011, 01:27 AM

[Axerax]

If enough people are on board to give it ago I will try to reboot this next month to include Games Under Construction,
the reason we ran out of projects is because nobody was nominating any more, implying that nobody thought any other projects were worthy of Project of the Month.

I'm still geared towards Project of the Year and just having the best projects of this year nominated to vote for.

Perhaps a competition called something like Monthly Project Awards and rather than whole projects winning, certain projects are nominated for different categories?
Like Best Character, Best Mapping, etc etc.

I'm happy that you'll at least consider it. I can't begin to explain my beliefs as to why no one is nominating, but my suggestion is all I can muster on how to help.

I'd hope so.

That might work better, because then the top 5 nominations could be brought up and multiple nominations as well.

You're not being punked. Arguments against what you have suggested have been provided. Also, you have made unsubstantiated claims like "you didn't run out of nominations so quickly" with your version of Project of the Month.

I wouldn't have, had I not had to leave and drop the ball to someone else. Can you explain to me about 5 nominations from each category would run out? When some people are saying there are 500 completed games? Then there shouldn't be a problem there because that's 60 games. 60 from each category.

My problem is that RRR wants to call it Project of the Month, but refuses to use exactly what I'm suggesting to add... Projects... I made the point pretty clear that you, as in you the staff members, should be picking the nominee's. This would include being able to decifer a quickly put together topic from a project that has obviously had time put into it. Rather than only picking from Completed Games and Long Demos. This contest is more of a pissing contest than a contest of effort and value.

Because, as I said, when we say projects, we are talking about recent projects.

I understand the name thing, but I just don't think there are enough projects of quality to make it worthwhile to open it up to Games Under Construction.

So what you're telling me, is if it is older than a year in development you'd over look it? Seems rather selfish or better yet, biased. There are plenty of projects over a year that look way better than some of these completed games and demo games. And that's all i've been trying to say is that very thing, because it's what I believe is truth, whether you agree or not that's how I will always look at that.

You may not think so, but you shouldn't let your opinion rule out everyone elses, then you just look like a dictator. This is a community, if people had a chance to vote on those projects I'm sure they would, but you limit what they can look at as a project of the month by doing how it is.

It's like looking at some hilton hotel that is gorgeous, then looking at the trump tower. Sure the hilton is already there and nice, but dang trump tower will out match it once it is done. It's a similar analogy.

[Ty]

In order to solve the lack of nominations, all that has to be done is to increase the scope of the award a little bit. Rename 'Project of the Month' to include something more broad, such as 'Indie Project of the Month' and instead of limiting nominations to projects only posted on RPG RPG Revolution, reach out a bit and include projects posted anywhere with any engine. However, the nominated project must not be established. This is to prevent nominations for games such as 'Braid' or 'World of Goo' to name two and instead focuses on a.) Newly released Indie games or b.) previously unknown games, then whoever is running IPOTM will contact the one who was nominated and inform them. This will open up hundreds of thousands of potential nominations. Indie flash games, indie commercial games, freeware, etcetc.

This has a few benefits for RRR. The first and most obvious is additional exposure outside of RPG Maker communities, which will bring in additional talented and more robust developers to this community. The second is RPG RPG Revolution will be talked about more outside of RM communities, give every winner and finalist/runner-up a a nicely designed medal image they can display on their site/topics. (Like in commercial games where it frequently lists awards the game has won) Lastly; although unlikely, is if a nominated game ever hits it big like 'Braid' or 'World of Goo' and RRR was involved in it's early success, its fair to assume the developer will hold a special place for RRR, which will increase the odds of them becoming a more long-term and contributing member. You may have noticed the common theme here is exposure.

After looking through the RM categories and reading through this topic, it's fair to assume that relying solely on RPG Maker games has become a bottleneck. Therefore the easiest solution would be to keep the foundation in place, but raise the roof. Turn PoTm into something which can bring in additional developers to the community, additional exposure and increased traffic.

My two cents.

[Oceans Dream]

That would be pretty cool. We can expose people to the other types of games so that people can look outside of their RMVX RTP hero has a tragic past and village got burned down and now 2 kingdoms are at war types of games and see what people outside the community are really working on.

I'd highly highly recommend Recettear for that nomination.
http://www.carpefulgur.com/recettear/

This post has been edited by Oceans Dream: May 28 2011, 08:54 AM

[Rob_Riv]

So what you're telling me, is if it is older than a year in development you'd over look it? Seems rather selfish or better yet, biased. There are plenty of projects over a year that look way better than some of these completed games and demo games. And that's all i've been trying to say is that very thing, because it's what I believe is truth, whether you agree or not that's how I will always look at that.

You may not think so, but you shouldn't let your opinion rule out everyone elses, then you just look like a dictator. This is a community, if people had a chance to vote on those projects I'm sure they would, but you limit what they can look at as a project of the month by doing how it is.

No, I'm not telling you that at all. I'm saying that there aren't enough quality projects that are actively being posted in.

Selfish? That doesn't make any sense.

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 28 2011, 12:13 PM

[Amy Pond]

Or just remove the need for nominations. My game has never been there because it's never been nominated >.> (I know that means it's not worthy, but you said there were lack of completed games to put forward so). You could just put all games released in x month into a poll.

[Harryb412]

Or just remove the need for nominations. My game has never been there because it's never been nominated >.> (I know that means it's not worthy, but you said there were lack of completed games to put forward so). You could just put all games released in x month into a poll.

That would be a good idea, but there might be too many projects in one month for a poll.
I'll try to keep a tally of how many new threads are made in one month and we could take it from there?

[Axerax]

In order to solve the lack of nominations, all that has to be done is to increase the scope of the award a little bit. Rename 'Project of the Month' to include something more broad, such as 'Indie Project of the Month' and instead of limiting nominations to projects only posted on RPG RPG Revolution, reach out a bit and include projects posted anywhere with any engine. However, the nominated project must not be established. This is to prevent nominations for games such as 'Braid' or 'World of Goo' to name two and instead focuses on a.) Newly released Indie games or b.) previously unknown games, then whoever is running IPOTM will contact the one who was nominated and inform them. This will open up hundreds of thousands of potential nominations. Indie flash games, indie commercial games, freeware, etcetc.

This has a few benefits for RRR. The first and most obvious is additional exposure outside of RPG Maker communities, which will bring in additional talented and more robust developers to this community. The second is RPG RPG Revolution will be talked about more outside of RM communities, give every winner and finalist/runner-up a a nicely designed medal image they can display on their site/topics. (Like in commercial games where it frequently lists awards the game has won) Lastly; although unlikely, is if a nominated game ever hits it big like 'Braid' or 'World of Goo' and RRR was involved in it's early success, its fair to assume the developer will hold a special place for RRR, which will increase the odds of them becoming a more long-term and contributing member. You may have noticed the common theme here is exposure.

After looking through the RM categories and reading through this topic, it's fair to assume that relying solely on RPG Maker games has become a bottleneck. Therefore the easiest solution would be to keep the foundation in place, but raise the roof. Turn PoTm into something which can bring in additional developers to the community, additional exposure and increased traffic.

My two cents.

This is a great idea in theory. But will RRR take the time to outsource and inform these websites that nominations are being taken for RRR's PotM by utilizing games from their website? The benefits are as you said, but the reality of such a IPotM like this coming into the light will not occur unless this website is prepared to take those extensive measures to cover their bases to make sure it is ran correctly.

I can agree, if they were invloved in the sucess even I would hold a special thanks for the site in the credits and my heart. Because who wants to forget their roots?

Yes they have become bottle necked, even if we have game maker games. Maybe we should outstretch RRR itself into an Indie Game Development website?

HarryB, I agree with you there. Your numbers will never be the same, it'll be one month (i.e. in the summer) 20 games developed and then another (i.e. in the winter) where you have 4 games developed. Now you've got uneven nomination lists. Good idea in theory, but poor in translation to reality.

[obsorber]

Why not try something new like the best promising game in construction of the month or something. This will be due to presentation of threads and promises in them which have to be proven through display of story, ideas, screenshots and videos that could promote projects in progress to show evidence. In all fairness it is getting rather boring seeing the same projects being nominated all the damn time. Vacant Sky is a prime example. We know it's a good game and one of the best in the community. But we know little about other projects that are in development. I know they are completed games but it can also give other developers WIP to gain some attention and shine too. Then they can either live up to the hype when they are released or fail miserably. This way more members are likely to want to come and join the community.

I truly agree with what Salerius said about its more difficult to release a full game than just to make promises of a good game. Why not just assess the projects in progress due to the amount of proof they have of their supposed quality which can be seen from screenshots, videos, the actual story and the way the thread is presented. This way the community will feel more like they are actual members and feel valued rather than just people constantly giving Kudos to the supposedly dominant projects that always get seem to get chosen.

Just remember something that is very important. A lot of the members may feel discriminated that they cannot rise up the hierarchy to show their skills as a developer because their projects never get the chance to shine so they put less effort into development and rush it just to get attention. I'm not taking sides but the games under construction actually gives the most feedback to players. It's also where most of the developers post their projects.

This post has been edited by obsorber: May 31 2011, 05:17 AM

[Rob_Riv]

In all fairness it is getting rather boring seeing the same projects being nominated all the damn time. Vacant Sky is a prime example. We know it's a good game and one of the best in the community. But we know little about other projects that are in development. I know they are completed games but it can also give other developers WIP to gain some attention and shine too.

Vacant Sky isn't getting nominated all the time. The issue is that projects that don't win that get renominated over and over. Good projects win awards at multiple sites, that's fair. It's not a good argument to say Vacant Sky shouldn't win Project of the Month here because it has won awards elsewhere.

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 31 2011, 07:21 AM

[obsorber]

Vacant Sky HAS won a few times not once. Its just an example so don't go looking into it too much into it. Lets not try and change the subject please. I really don't want a debate over which projects get nominated or whatever I just think the rest of the community should be more open to project of the month.

[Rob_Riv]

Vacant Sky HAS won a few times not once. Its just an example so don't go looking into it too much into it. Lets not try and change the subject please. I really don't want a debate over which projects get nominated or whatever I just think the rest of the community should be more open to project of the month.

It hasn't though. If you're going to make that claim, at least have be specific in how many times Vacant Sky has been nominated or has won Project of the Month on this forum.

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 31 2011, 10:08 AM

[obsorber]

Again, the subject is being changed. But if you must know so bad I can remember at least twice and I wouldn't be surprised if it was more. I don't really know to be honest so you tell me. It's usually the same projects that get nominated, one of them gets to shine with enough votes and there aren't as many complete games as there are projects in development.

Lastly, stop moving away from the main subject. That isn't even that relevant to what I am saying if you bothered to read my post rather than just pick a point that was debated about earlier you would know my post isn't about that. It's about a constructive idea that the staff could either look into or disregard. That way you can have two main threads about project of the month, completed games/long demos and underdevelopment games. It's just an idea.

This post has been edited by obsorber: May 31 2011, 10:27 AM

[Rob_Riv]

Vacant Sky has won Project of the Month once (March 2011) from what I can see. The subject hasn't really been changed.

Lastly, stop moving away from the main subject. That isn't even that relevant to what I am saying if you bothered to read my post rather than just pick a point that was debated about earlier you would know my post isn't about that. It's about a constructive idea that the staff could either look into or disregard. That way you can have two main threads about project of the month, completed games/long demos and underdevelopment games. It's just an idea.

I'm not moving away from the main subject. I did read your post. I specifically mentioned a point you made and an example of that point that was incorrect. I don't believe the thing I mentioned was "debated earlier".

Obsorber, there isn't a great deal of interest in Project of the Month, let alone another thread for an "Underdeveloped Game of the Month" contest.

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 31 2011, 10:36 AM

[Axerax]

Vacant Sky HAS won a few times not once. Its just an example so don't go looking into it too much into it. Lets not try and change the subject please. I really don't want a debate over which projects get nominated or whatever I just think the rest of the community should be more open to project of the month.

It hasn't though. If you're going to make that claim, at least have be specific in how many times Vacant Sky has been nominated or has won Project of the Month on this forum.

He isn't saying that it has won multiple awards on this site, he is saying on multiple sites and in general. You're over analyzing the statement and questions he brought up, the same way you did to me.

In fact he is saying exactly what I suggested in more or less words. You should look at how others view situations and not simply your self and why you believe they are wrong and you are right. I'm trying to be nice, but you've got an anger management issue of what Anger Management Teachers say is the Always Being Right Fallacy. It may not be agressive anger, but it's definitely negative. You and I will never always be right, so what I'm saying is to take a walk in the other man's shoes for once.

He's made a lot of great points, some I couldn't word my self, and he used examples to explain what he is trying to point out and suggest.
-Axerax

[Rob_Riv]

He isn't saying that it has won multiple awards on this site, he is saying on multiple sites and in general. You're over analyzing the statement and questions he brought up, the same way you did to me.

If that is the case, Vacant Sky winning an award on another site shouldn't affect whether it gets nominated for Project of the Month here. I am not "over analysing" it.

In fact he is saying exactly what I suggested in more or less words. You should look at how others view situations and not simply your self and why you believe they are wrong and you are right. I'm trying to be nice, but you've got an anger management issue of what Anger Management Teachers say is the Always Being Right Fallacy. It may not be agressive anger, but it's definitely negative. You and I will never always be right, so what I'm saying is to take a walk in the other man's shoes for once.

I do not have an anger management issue. What specific points and arguments have I raised that are incorrect?

This post has been edited by Rob_Riv: May 31 2011, 11:31 AM

[obsorber]

Thanks Axerax for your support.

There are many ways of improving the RRR community and although what I suggested may not be the best way I'm sure there are other methods that can be done.

This post has been edited by obsorber: May 31 2011, 04:30 PM

[Axerax]

You're welcome. I'm glad you have similar views, if I had been given the chance to continue this like I said I would in the suggestion topic that Kaz posted, I would have.

Yes it may not be the best, but it's something and funnily enough it's a common idea that a few of us on this topic have suggested or agreed with.

Just to clarify a few things.

The word Project's Definition:
Origin:
1350–1400; (noun)Middle English project( e) design, plan

The word Recent's Definition:
Origin:
1525–35; < Latin recent- (stem ofrecēns) fresh, new

Sure you can use the word Recent to refer to the age of man compared to the age of dinosaurs as being recent, but that's years upon years, but in reality the human races existence is very recent compared to other creatures that have and/or still roam Earth. The way you are using recent is exactly as the origin states, something that is new within the latest month or even few weeks/days. How can you expect that many long demos and completed games to come out within that time frame?

You can't expect that projects in development are not worthy of spotlight, especially when you have people like James Cameron, the direct of Alien and many other great movies, who spent 8 years of production to create Avatar, a blockbuster bombshell, simply because he wanted to wait for better technology to better visualize his dream/idea of this movie to the audience. All I’m saying is that there are plenty of projects out there who could live up to that potential, you don't have the right to say that no projects there are worthy of this competition, have you even taken a good hard look and analyzed some of these projects? If you have not, let me know when you do.

[Sailerius]

have you even taken a good hard look and analyzed some of these projects? If you have not, let me know when you do.

Didn't you just say earlier that you yourself haven't? Practice what you preach.