Requesting help, Suggestions welcome Options

[Under]

I've posted twice now in the recruitment forum and both times no one's been interested in helping me. I realize both times I shared very little and I had a lot I was asking for. Now I'm planning on posting again (I don't think it's a problem to repost after the original has died, especially if I'm looking for something different now), but before I do I want to know what I should and shouldn't do when looking for help. What is it that's keeping people from being interested? Is there something I specifically need to do before I post?

Here are links to my first and previous posts. First post Second post

The website I set up a while ago has just been updated. It's now got more information than it did before. You can find a link to it at the bottom of the second post.

Suggestions and general conversation about this is welcome.

This post has been edited by Under: Apr 5 2012, 02:02 PM

[Klokinator]

You've posted a topic in recruitment, one of the boards that statistically gets the least number of replies, and your game is essentially a clone of Harvest Moon, except not as good. Also, your mapping isn't the... best, and when you post screenshots they look awful. Part of what makes a recruitment drive actually work, like when I wanted beta testers, is going after one specific position at a time. Instead of

I NEED MAPPER MUSICIAN ARTIST AND GAME MAKER

Which looks like you're basically saying "make this game for me", you should only aim for a musician, or only a coder, or only a spriter. Also, PMing individual members works a lot better than recruitment posts anyways. Nobody reads those, and fewer respond.

[Under]

... your game is essentially a clone of Harvest Moon, except not as good.

Well I do have to say it just started out as a want to make video games (I had no plans), but it eventually changed into a story-driven game (which is where I was when I posted the second time).

Also, your mapping isn't the... best, and when you post screenshots they look awful.

Maybe it makes a difference to the people reading the post, but if I thought my mapping skills were great or even decent I'd seriously consider mapping myself. I was only trying to give a basic understanding of what I thought the world would look like. [Edit- I wasn't looking for a mapper (I thought I was), so I guess your comment was on the mark] Also (without screenshots) I could be talking big, but have done no work.
As far as horrible screen shots... I don't know what else I could have done. I took pictures of what it looked like in the game. Not that it looked good, but that's why I wanted help. Of course maybe I could have done better at showing the game working, instead of just "Here's a cow. Look, another cow. Hey, look, a barn." [Edit- I looked over the screen shots for the first time in a long time and realized I did do that.... ]

Part of what makes a recruitment drive actually work, like when I wanted beta testers, is going after one specific position at a time. Instead of

I NEED MAPPER MUSICIAN ARTIST AND GAME MAKER

Which looks like you're basically saying "make this game for me", you should only aim for a musician, or only a coder, or only a spriter.

Hmmm... you mean I came off as demanding? I don't want anyone to make Husbandry for me. I realize I need help if it's going to be the best it can be, which is why I'm looking. I've put a lot of work into the game (I've been working on it for a year now), I've redone a lot of things, rethought a lot of things, and I've learned a lot. I realise there is a lot to do, which is why I tried to warn people ahead of time so they wouldn't feel like I dumped a truckload of work on their laps. I also was trying to be negotiable as far as how much time people spent helping (they would be helping after-all).

Also, PMing individual members works a lot better than recruitment posts anyways. Nobody reads those, and fewer respond.

I thought that would be considered either rude or spam.... Anyways I can't do that now because I'm more strict as to who helps me (yes it'll be even harder finding help that way), so I really need people to come to me, not the other way around.

Anyways, I felt affended at first, but you probably did bring up some good points Klokinator: thanks. Also, you only referenced to my first post, my second is (obviously since I had gotten further) farther along as far as descriptions and so on.

This post has been edited by Under: Apr 5 2012, 03:17 PM

[Klokinator]

Well, I like to make it seem like my game doesn't need a lot of work done. I'm like "Yeah my mapper has this covered, I've got this covered, I'll just need a few things from you."

The person will join my team, see me and everyone else working hard, and want to work hard too. With my positive energy ("Hey I got this, but if you wanna help more I totally have something you can do!") they think of me as a motivating project leader who handles all the really big things. Mapping isn't a huge part of FE, after all one map is probably hours of playtime anyway. And the art isn't something really needed, so most of the game that you see a lot of is the work that I do. But in a different kind of game, like Husbandry, there will be hundreds of maps, most likely, so being a mapper is a demanding job.

The point is, nobody wants to work hard. They just don't. If you make a thread saying "HEY I HAVE A LOT DONE BUT I SERIOUSLY NEED A LOT OF HELP PLEASE HELP MEEEE" (Which, regardless of intention or not, that's how both threads come off to me), then people assume you're not very knowledgable, so why should they help you? And they also assume they'll have to do a lot of work, and as a rule everyone is lazy so they don't want to do a lot of work.

If they see a project that needs a little help, looks promising, and is something they can manage in between THEIR projects, they'll help. It doesn't matter if there is actually a lot of work, don't say there is a lot of work. Say there's a little, and slowly increase it once someone joins until you reach a comfortable pace.

My two cents.

[Under]

Well I see your point as far as not turning people off before they even know what's been done and how cool (if you could say that) the game is. I also think you're probably right about not asking for too many different people at once, so I'll keep that in mind. Hey, do you think it would be beneficial to look for help on another site as well, would that be pointless, or would it hurt me?


This post has been edited by Under: Apr 5 2012, 03:13 PM

[Klokinator]

I got all the members of my team from multiple sites. Two team members are from the original FEXP site, my mapper is from my "home forum", Shrine of Seals, my artist is from newgrounds, as well as my musician, my beta testers are almost exclusively from RRR, and etc etc.

So, probably not a bad idea.

[Magical_RuNE_Kni...]

i think... well... the first topic was kinda wordy. But the 2nd version was much better. : ))

i dunno, i think you should put more pictures and maybe still reduce the amount of words? Also maybe put the important stuff at the top.
You don't sound like a very convincing leader and... well, it's kind of hard to tell how much progress you've gotten in the project.

Yeah... recruitment can be slow, but maybe you need to think of it as a marketing kind of thing? Like.. sell the idea of why we should work with you...

You need some Ethos (reliability/good background) and Logos (logic/facts). And i dunno, personally, when i'm looking for something to join, i usually kind of look for interesting things that stick out, or games that look like could have use for pictures/ hint at what kind of job i'll prolly be expecting; or, games that have been successful and don't look like it'll collapse, or an idea of who i'll be working with... like volunteering in real life i guess, aha.

[Under]

I got all the members of my team from multiple sites. Two team members are from the original FEXP site, my mapper is from my "home forum", Shrine of Seals, my artist is from newgrounds, as well as my musician, my beta testers are almost exclusively from RRR, and etc etc.

So, probably not a bad idea.

Cool, thanks!

At Magical_RuNE_Knight2001

i dunno, i think you should put more pictures and maybe still reduce the amount of words? Also maybe put the important stuff at the top.

I was thinking about talking less and saying more (or something like that). The pictures might not be a bad idea, but my game doesn't look that great right now (I'm in the middle of fixing it).

You don't sound like a very convincing leader and... well, it's kind of hard to tell how much progress you've gotten in the project.

I've never had any experience leading. I haven't got everything figured out yet (which I know can be a big problem), but I do have a lot of ideas now and what I'm mostly looking for is someone who can come along and help me flesh out my ideas more. Right now I'm the only one working on Husbandry, and it's easy to overlook things when there's no one to help you see problems in your plans.
As far as the progress: I've tried to clear that up as much as I can on my website, but I'm still not sure if it's good enough. At the same time I don't know what else I could say.

Yeah... recruitment can be slow, but maybe you need to think of it as a marketing kind of thing? Like.. sell the idea of why we should work with you...

Good idea. I should do that instead of just thinking about it.

Well, I'll keep what you said in mind too. Thanks Magical.

This post has been edited by Under: Apr 5 2012, 04:34 PM

[Magical_RuNE_Kni...]

You're welcome, i hope i helped. : ) gl!