Nicsp's NEW Art Topic, Coz the old one was starting to stink. Options

[Angelic-Fairy]

Just for the record
maybe if you actually looked at
oh i dont know
his other posts
from other ppl
and other pictures
before this most recent one you commented on
then you would know he does say thank you
maybe you shouldnt be so quick to judge.

[Nicsp]

This guy asked for critique, and he has been replyed with LOT of good critique without saying "thank you" a single time, and without applying any of the suggestions... he only respond with excuses.

That's bullshit and if you can't read all of the stuff i have posted so far or what i'm about to quote right now, it's your problem, don't make it mine.

Welcome to my new art topic, i thought it would be a good idea to make a new one, mostly because the old was filled with drawings i thought looked horrible. I wanted to take a deep breath and then start thanking everyone who helped me improve by posting on my old thread, you guys/girls all helped me a lot to get where i am now, and i am ever "Oh so thankful". Weren't it for the help of all of those people i'd probably still be drawing like this.

But i send thanks for everyone for being now able to draw like THIS.

Thanks Adriantepes, i've just been practicing a lot, XD, i wonder, however, if i managed to improve this much in a year, and i'll be making 16 this year...I wonder how well will i draw when i'm like...20? MWHAHAHAH.

Thanks Homu, yes, i know about the personalizing thing, actually, i'm having issues however finding something to add on that i like. By example, when i tried to add more details to the eyes, i end up getting details wrong and then they look like crap D=

And thanks for the compliment, what i actually do is, i get the drawing, scan it (Obvious so far XD), and then after opening the image the first thing i do is put a layer over it, and then i start using the line tool and eraser only on that layer to draw over the pencil one. After i have copied over the whole drawing from the scanned layer to the digital layer, i delete the scanned layer and start colouring the digital layer. Does that make sense? I'm not very good at explaining stuff, so if you want, just ask me and i'll make a few pictures to explain it better.

Thanks, i'm trying really hard to improve and your suggestions have been helping me a lot.Off-topic question: Everytime i look at your avatar picture i just have to ask myself, are your eyes really of that colour? If so, i envy you.

@lyla2284 Lol thanks, and yep it is. (Lyla commented that this was a very helpful and supportive community)

Thanks XD

Thank you! I'd be honored to have you do fanart of my stuff

The last picture reminds me of Fei Long for some reason. Looks alright.

Thanks. Although i'm not sure i like the idea of being compared to Fei Long >.> <.< >.<

Thank you ^^

Thanks Sparrow ^^

Thanks Sparrow >.<


Thanks for the criticism Sparrow XD I really appreciate it ^.^

Thank you :3

-facepalm-

Lol, yeah. I just realized that as well, i had planned to put his name higher up and closer to him, like he was leaning on it. Oh well >_>

Thanks. And you say my style resembles Emperor's New Groove...? I don't really see nor intended any similarities, but it's possible, considering it was one of my favourite movies. Subconscious ftw.

Thanks much

Haha. Thanks, and I know what you're talking about. I'm still getting used to making the lines all in one go. (Instead of doing short ones and trying to connect them each at a time.) So a few of them are bound to look a bit bendy x_x

Thanks! ^^

Yeah, the whole picture took about 6 hours or so if i'm not mistaken >_<;;

And even if i came a long way i still have a long way to go, my stuff still looks like crap if compared to some of the other pictures i see around the web. x_x

Oh and happy New Years, RRR.

Thanks Homu, i did check that Otaku after you mentioned it. It seems to be mostly for fan art though, something i don't really do much DX I'll probably make an account and post any fan arts i eventually do in there.

And thanks XMO, glad you liked it XD Good luck with your goals for you too.

Thanks Sparrow.

The expression is "Just my 2 cents"

Thanks for the feedback, however.

I do get defensive when people comment about what i draw, yes, i do respond with excuses most of the time, yes, but i can safely tell you that i haven't lied in this thread a single time. So just for your information i do thank everyone who commented on this thread, and i am respectful to everyone who did so as well, as much as i freaking hate you right now, i do respect you as well because i did look on your art thread and i haven't commented on it just because i didn't really think i had any good criticism that i could give because i thought your stuff was pretty good. So next time you decide to go and attack someone even though you have no god damn reason to, don't.

Edit: Rofl, i quoted so many posts that it glitched, i removed some quote codes.

Edit2: I just realized there's an awful lots of "Thanks Sparrow" in there, haha. XD

This post has been edited by Nicsp: Feb 7 2011, 02:02 PM

[bacon]

Well in concerning your last picture~

To be honest I really could not tell that was a female. Remember that gender body shape differs between persons. A lot of males heads are shaped more jagged and pointy while female heads are a lot more rounded. There are other differences as well such as hip placement, shoulders, neck, legs, etc. While males and females look alike in terms of a species they differ greatly. I would definitely try to work on your females some more; it looks like you are more accustomed to drawing males. Its definitely good if you are trying to step out of your zone but make sure to look up some stuff. The best thing to do actually is people watch. Find the subtle differences on how men and females walk, use body language, pose, move their hips,

Also work on your blocking out shapes and stuff. It looks like you arent doing enough. I know this may sound silly but work with layers and stuff. In your first layer make a basic rough sketch. In your second do muscle layout. And your top layer should be the actual thing. Trust me, I know its super hard to trace over what you made before in the lower layers but you will get better it just takes a ton of practice. What I think is a good idea for you at the moment is to do rough sketches without coloring or anything and show us how you are blocking your stuff.

Your stroke lines are a lot better it must of been that one picture.

In terms of shading and coloring you are using silly textures. Just give us some normal color hair without the texture.

Some really good hair tuts someone posted on another forum

chiggedy-check these
http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=photoshop%...fset=24#/drd2sa
http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=photoshop%...fset=72#/ddhlct
http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=photoshop%...set=72#/d1j8g09 <- face is awful but hair is good
http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=photoshop%...et=120#/d1ufc73

In terms of shading. Instead of doing a whole bunch of colors, start in one step at a time. Get used to a basic shadow and then start highlights and stuff. Post your progress its always interesting to watch people learn.

I know you aren't super into drawing like you said but its always some food for thought

This post has been edited by bacon: Feb 7 2011, 03:41 PM

[Nicsp]

Well in concerning your last picture~

To be honest I really could not tell that was a female. Remember that gender body shape differs between persons. A lot of males heads are shaped more jagged and pointy while female heads are a lot more rounded. There are other differences as well such as hip placement, shoulders, neck, legs, etc. While males and females look alike in terms of a species they differ greatly. I would definitely try to work on your females some more; it looks like you are more accustomed to drawing males. Its definitely good if you are trying to step out of your zone but make sure to look up some stuff. The best thing to do actually is people watch. Find the subtle differences on how men and females walk, use body language, pose, move their hips.

Uhm...I was teached that, also, as far as i know, males and females can be differientiated (On manga at least) by the shape of their eyes and size of their irises (Females have larger irises and their eye shapes are more round.) Oh and yeah, i don't have much experience drawing females hence one of the main reasons why i'm actually making this practice comic's protagonist a female XD

Also work on your blocking out shapes and stuff. It looks like you arent doing enough. I know this may sound silly but work with layers and stuff. In your first layer make a basic rough sketch. In your second do muscle layout. And your top layer should be the actual thing. Trust me, I know its super hard to trace over what you made before in the lower layers but you will get better it just takes a ton of practice. What I think is a good idea for you at the moment is to do rough sketches without coloring or anything and show us how you are blocking your stuff.

. . .But i DO that. >_> I'll post some pics of how i sketch later.

Your stroke lines are a lot better it must of been that one picture.



In terms of shading and coloring you are using silly textures. Just give us some normal color hair without the texture.

Like i said above the picture, that was just me playing with SAI's tools. >_>

Some really good hair tuts someone posted on another forum

chiggedy-check these
http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=photoshop%...fset=24#/drd2sa
http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=photoshop%...fset=72#/ddhlct
http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=photoshop%...set=72#/d1j8g09 <- face is awful but hair is good
http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=photoshop%...et=120#/d1ufc73

TUTS

In terms of shading. Instead of doing a whole bunch of colors, start in one step at a time. Get used to a basic shadow and then start highlights and stuff. Post your progress its always interesting to watch people learn.

Again, i do that. Lol.

I know you aren't super into drawing like you said but its always some food for thought

I know, thanks for your feedback, i appreciate it a lot.

Answers are bolded inside the quote.

This post has been edited by Nicsp: Feb 7 2011, 03:59 PM

[bacon]

oh man I wasnt telling you that you didnt do that stuff i was saying that you should try to do some pure essential art with just basic stuff ~o:

here is a terrible website for plastic surgery but it has a lot of good differences in terms of males and females with face structure

http://www.facialfeminizationsurgery.info/...male_faces.html

One thing you should not do is manga. Manga is something super stylized. You can make proper manga without first practicing basic realistic stuff and mastering that. Then you combine style and break it down until you get what you call manga.

In terms of resources and looking at stuff, try looking at human (like human like photography) and break it down. Do some realistic stuff and then slowly start building off a style.

Your face is wonky i will tell you right now those are not the only differences between gender faces in any sort of art.

When I say realistic I mean will proper anatomy and stuff. It doesnt have to have superb shading or anything just give us some basic more realistic art.

I never said you didnt do that its more of that I want to see how you do that kind of stuff. I would love to see you break it down step by step. ~o:

I know this sounds silly but you will increase ten fold. Not only that im interested on what you can do with realistic stuff. ~o:

This post has been edited by bacon: Feb 7 2011, 04:23 PM

[leongon]

Interesting, looks like the excuses blind me for the "thank you" words. Unless those were edited and added later(doesn't seem to) is my fault and I apologize for saying you don't thank people lately.

However, may be my lack of experience, but I still see the progress in your pictures, with important critique and tips between them, and there are no application of any of those suggestion you got. So in this I mantain my words, you are either improving extremely slowly or you, as I guess, are giving just excuses for not take what people suggest to you.


In any and all cases, this fag(speaking in third person) are bringing lot of attention to your thread, thing that always is good. I'll just enjoy if I can see a picture of yours where one, ONE, of the suggestions you got is at least attempted to be used... Start with doing something realistic, harder, then if you go back to draw anime crap it will result easier and better.

This post has been edited by leongon: Feb 7 2011, 05:13 PM

[Nicsp]

[Show/Hide] Spoilering my last reply to leongon's shenanigans because i've had enough off-topicness.

@leongon

Interesting, looks like the excuses blind me for the "thank you" words. Unless those were edited and added later(doesn't seem to) is my fault and I apologize for saying you don't thank people lately.

However, may be my lack of experience, but I still see the progress in your pictures, with important critique and tips between them, and there are no application of any of those suggestion you got. So in this I mantain my words, you are either improving extremely slowly or you, as I guess, are giving just excuses for not take what people suggest to you.


In any and all cases, this fag(speaking in third person) are bringing lot of attention to your thread, thing that always is good. I'll just enjoy if I can see a picture of yours where one, ONE, of the suggestions you got is at least attempted to be used... Start with doing something realistic, harder, then if you go back to draw anime crap it will result easier and better.

First and foremost, you're not bringing attention to my thread, you're bringing drama to it and steering it away from it's main intent that it was for people to look at my pictures and critique and/or give suggestions, the CLOSEST thing you said to a critique was "eyes told that there are three light sources but no shades match them consistently" where you didn't even bother to properly explain what you're talking about. And just for your information, i couldn't have possibly edited the "thank yous" in because now the forum shows when was the last times post were edited, so drop this shit. Oh, and you say you want to see somewhere where i actually followed my suggestions? How about you try the first very fucking page.

WOW, Nescafe! Look at that! You're certainly growing as an artist here, I must say that I'm thoroughly impressed on your development : D BUT, what impresses me even more is your openness to comments and suggestions!!!

Really though, I love your attention to detail in the design :3 I hate when some people add design to outfits that really are just random lines and patterns thrown on there that really don't relate to the outfit itself, it really doesn't look impressive lol but the details you added there look absolutely fabulous, especially the shoulder pads! Love the hair and hair color! The lines are super smooth, which is AWESOME, and the coloring is nice and smooth : D You've come a long way bud!!

As for suggestions, keep practicing at anatomy, and I'd say try... How to say it... Personalize your faces??? Like right now, it's a general anime style which is certainly great, and I used to get pissed when people gave me this advice but LOL after finally following the advice I'm very grateful to those who gave me the advice. Try playing around with the facial features though. Instead of just plain lines for the eyes, try adding some detail for your own personal touch. Instead of just a line for a mouth try adding a bit of detail, even if it's just a line below to indicate a bottom lip! (I do this, in case you didn't notice, you probably didn't, since i'm guessing you just skip through everything and accuse away.) Instead of just a check mark for the nose, try adding some nostrils maybe or something, anything to make the style your own :3 And lastly, the hips, I actually drew a pic cause I dunno how to describe it thoroughly LOL I would just angle the hips more. Right now they're very curved, like ) ( when really there's more of an angle there, like


But really Nescafe, I hope you're happy with yourself and proud of your progress, you're doing absolutely marvelous!

And on her next post.

AH! THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT, LOOK AT THOSE HIPS! In that most recent full body pic, whether you meant to or not or realized it or not LOL that's EXACTLY what I meant with the hips, you got it Nescafe : D
Wow man, your art! KEEP IT UP, I am so proud of you!!!! You keep improving so much with every picture you post!! Your female character looks absolutely beautiful, and this most recent one is so impressive! You've come a long way and you keep getting better and better :3 give yourself a pat on the back and keep up the great work!

So, please, either actually try to type something that's actually worth my fucking time or don't ever bother to post in here again. This is the second time that i waste away the little free time i have this year stressing myself over YOUR crap and typing a god damn response.

@bacon
But, the thing is, i DO want to do Manga, lol. I did learn realism but then i skipped into manga as soon as i got the chance, because manga IS kind of my objective, lol. But fair enough, i'll work on a realistic-ish piece later today and i'll post the step by step of how i do it. (And i hope you don't mind if i settle for a face picture...A full body picture would take too much time...Time which i was hoping to use so i could get started on my comic project and draw a Valentine's day card >_>)

[bacon]

But, the thing is, i DO want to do Manga, lol. I did learn realism but then i skipped into manga as soon as i got the chance, because manga IS kind of my objective, lol. But fair enough, i'll work on a realistic-ish piece later today and i'll post the step by step of how i do it. (And i hope you don't mind if i settle for a face picture...A full body picture would take too much time...Time which i was hoping to use so i could get started on my comic project and draw a Valentine's day card >_>)

I guess what I am trying to say is to do manga you have to be able to do realism first. You cant just bump into manga because then it looks amateurish. Realism isnt fruit drawing kind of thing. Its just doing basic stuff that matches proportion sizes and stuff

And with leongon I understand what you are saying but please dont be rude here. I mean, you seem kind of stand-offish. We are trying to help you. Its a fact that your proportions look off and that you need work on your art. I mean I respect Homunculus greatly and stuff but she says these things with everyone. Yes you have improved but no it doesn't look like manga at all. I think you may have studied realism but I dont think you have really practiced it and you jumped on the manga bandwagon too early. It would be really neat to see you improve and stuff but the stuff you have at the moment isn't stylistic at all.

I know Ive said the same thing like ten times but cmon man, dont be rude to people who have spent 15 minutes out of their time to write you a cohesive critique instead of going "LOL this is good".

If you study these things and practice them more then you will get better faster and you will will feel a lot better about your art. I mean I have had some really good artists give this advice to me along with other people Im just passing it along~

This post has been edited by bacon: Feb 8 2011, 11:55 AM

[Nicsp]

I guess what I am trying to say is to do manga you have to be able to do realism first. You cant just bump into manga because then it looks amateurish. Realism isnt fruit drawing kind of thing. Its just doing basic stuff that matches proportion sizes and stuff

Again, lol, i am able to do realism, it's not professional looking or anything, but i'd say it's good enough. (Judge it yourself below.)

And with leongon I understand what you are saying but please dont be rude here. I mean, you seem kind of stand-offish. We are trying to help you. Its a fact that your proportions look off and that you need work on your art. I mean I respect Homunculus greatly and stuff but she says these things with everyone. Yes you have improved but no it doesn't look like manga at all. I think you may have studied realism but I dont think you have really practiced it and you jumped on the manga bandwagon too early. It would be really neat to see you improve and stuff but the stuff you have at the moment isn't stylistic at all.

I know Ive said the same thing like ten times but cmon man, dont be rude to people who have spent 15 minutes out of their time to write you a cohesive critique instead of going "LOL this is good".

My problem with leongon is the fact that he was accusing me of not being thankful to everyone who has critiqued me and of not having any respect for any of them. When i have actually thanked everyone AND hold a lot of respect for all of them. I don't mind having people say my art is bad, i don't mind people saying stuff about my attitude, but i do mind when people accuse me of things i did not do.

If you study these things and practice them more then you will get better faster and you will will feel a lot better about your art. I mean I have had some really good artists give this advice to me along with other people Im just passing it along~

Haha, like i said, i've heard much of that advice before myself, thanks for poking me with it once more, anyways. XD And to be quite honest, i feel quite okay about my art, lol, i may not be in a professional level or anything but i'm good enough for the stuff i usually use it to. (Entretainment and making characters for RPs.)

Comments bolded inside quote.

At any rate, you asked for me to do a realist picture and show step by step, so here you go. Edit: Was actually an interesting experience, first time i attempted a more realistic style via tablet.

[Show/Hide] Spoilered due to size.

This post has been edited by Nicsp: Feb 8 2011, 12:40 PM

[bacon]

Definitely work on your shadows and stuff a little bit more. I am not really good at shadows either but you dont have a light source or anything

http://nedroid.com/2009/05/color-me-surprised/
http://www.itchstudios.com/psg/art_tut.htm (easily one of the most comprehensive art tutorials on the internet)
http://monstercutie.com/2009/03/27/digi ... nting-101/
http://www.conceptart.org/forums/forumd ... forumid=42

painting tutorials

In terms of proportions it definitely decent but there is always room to improve. I think honestly you should continue with that and then come back to manga it would look so much better when you come back and you can apply multiple ideas into your drawing it would be oh so lovely.

But thats just my opinion but I think you would improve +10000 art points and +50000 manga points.

[Nicsp]

Definitely work on your shadows and stuff a little bit more. I am not really good at shadows either but you dont have a light source or anything

Picture wasn't supposed to have one...But okay, lol.

http://nedroid.com/2009/05/color-me-surprised/
http://www.itchstudios.com/psg/art_tut.htm (easily one of the most comprehensive art tutorials on the internet)
http://monstercutie.com/2009/03/27/digi ... nting-101/
http://www.conceptart.org/forums/forumd ... forumid=42

painting tutorials

[b]Thanks XD You alredy gave me some of these, though. >_>[/b] Wait, those are the exact same you posted earlier, lol. You don't need to post them again >_<

In terms of proportions it definitely decent but there is always room to improve. I think honestly you should continue with that and then come back to manga it would look so much better when you come back and you can apply multiple ideas into your drawing it would be oh so lovely.

Haha, all right, i'll probably be still posting manga around here, but i SWEAR i will be practicing realism every chance i get. (No point in just dropping manga now and then focusing on realism just to go back to manga later, so i'll focus on both instead.)

But thats just my opinion but I think you would improve +10000 art points and +50000 manga points.

That's all right, and hey, manga is art too, lol. Thanks a lot for all of the feedback you've given and all of the links you've given, you've been really helpful. Say, you said you draw as well, do you have an art thread here on RRR? Or maybe DevArt?

This post has been edited by Nicsp: Feb 8 2011, 01:16 PM

[bacon]

Oh man I am actually really excited to see what you plop out. I found it easier to practice realism on paper before tablet but different people like different things. If you practice you will definitely see and improvement and six pages later you will be see a difference I think (I hope!)

Also i didnt realize i gave you those tuts i am just posting tuts as I go~

In terms of art I am really studying proportion and I am really not that good at art and stuff more like an artist in training but I can whip out a thread but honestly I think you would be rather disappointed I am no where near to decent. I just repeat what other people say oh gosh. :c

[leongon]

I may be rude, but I gave you many useful tips that you are not able to grab behind your defensive wall... that's fine, being able to take the best of what people tell you is a talent.

However, not having a specific talent is not that bad, you just need more practice and experience to do the same as someone talented... Just hard work.

I can tell you another tip, and this time I'll lend it to you clearly, so you don't miss the help: Your main talent problem is the lack of observation skill. See Leonidas neck lighting, and then see your drawing.

And stop barking.

[Nicsp]

Woof woof, lol.

Right then, thanks for the tips both of you, i'll keep them in mind.

This post has been edited by Nicsp: Feb 8 2011, 03:39 PM

[rivette]

Your attitude towards criticism is the exact opposite of conducive. If you keep thanking the people who give complimentary half-crits and then hide behind a wall of excuses from the legitimate points, your art is going to stagnate and even get worse over time. This is probably going to be glossed over because it's too "harsh", but I honestly want to see you improve - I love art and helping people with art, and it is very unfortunate to me to see people fall into creative ruts.

You cite a heavily referenced, badly shaded face as proof you know how to do "realism" but I see no such thing. Your light sources are inconsistent, your colors are unpleasant, and your strokes are hesitant and shaky. It's not pleasant to hear but if you want to do any sort of stylization WELL - be it anime, cartoon, or anything, you need to have a very firm grasp on basic artistic fundamentals. No offense, but from the "realist" painting you've posted, you do not have this yet.

I'm not trying to insult you or say that you're terrible at all, in truth what I'm really doing is criticizing your response to criticism. You say "thanks i'll look at that and keep it in mind^^" but you apparently don't. It's hard and it even hurts your feelings sometimes, but when the hard-hitting criticism rolls around you need to pay attention and not hand-wave it away. Just because it isn't saccharine doesn't mean it's not worthwhile criticism.

[Nicsp]

-sigh-

All right, fine, you're all right, i'm doing it all wrong. I get it alredy, the message has alredy been taken, you guys don't need to keep beating me with it. It'd be nice if you actually at least told me if i'm at least doing SOMETHING right, because, according to what i've been told in the past few days, i've been doing it all wrong for the past 3 damn years and should just throw it all away and start from scratch.

This post has been edited by Nicsp: Feb 9 2011, 02:35 PM

[leongon]

You really are not able to take criticism, you only want the usual "OMG you're amazing"... Emo? children maybe?


Anyways, the criticism in this subforum is only optional and is given only when the author ask for it... Tell clearly "No more critique plz" and you'll get only the empty but nice flowers.

This post has been edited by leongon: Feb 9 2011, 02:43 PM

[Nicsp]

Ok... I guess i can be classified as "emo", and i am 16 years old, so yes, i guess i do classify as a child. But you know what, whatever, i couldn't care less about what some random dude in the internet thinks about me, actually, the sad part is, i DO damn care, as much i don't want to. I never said i wanted only wanted to hear nice things, i just said that i'd like if there i was told if i was actually doing something right, but apparently you're so blind that you can't even read what i've been typing for the past days, and not because of my excuses, by the way, because i just stopped even trying to excuse myself for quite a while now, not that it matters anyways, you just keep bashing with the same points.

I draw because it's my way of having fun, i draw because it's my escape from stress, i don't want to become a professional artist and neither would i ever dream of even being able to achieve that. I'm not drawing to please you, i'm drawing to please myself. Ever since this crap started i've just been bashed in the face several times with the very same thing and replied multiple times that i got the message across and that i would practice my realism, because, yes, i know it sucks, it's not perfect, it will never be, i'm a human being not a camera. Just because i was told something it doesn't mean i'm going to pick it up instantly, i take time to consider what has been told to me and then apply it, playing with it for a quite a while to understand how it works instead of just copy and pasting it.

But enough, i'm going to draw and i'm going to improve, and i'm going to do it the way i want to do it. If i do it wrong and make my art look each time more like complete and utter shit that's my problem, not yours, and i'll keep getting worse and worse at it, but hey, i'll be doing it and be happy about it myself, which is and has always been my objective, so it's fine.

There's no need for this anymore, closing this thread.